Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

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Starrmark
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Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Starrmark » Sat Jan 16, 2010 5:34 pm

In 1901, Puccini composed a Requiem for the Death of Giuseppe Verdi, for STB, viola and harmonium. It was performed in a public ceremony in Italy that year. It was also recorded on early 78s. When was it (the sheetmusic) first published (presumably in Italy)?

Today, there is an edition published by Elkan-Vogel, edited by Pietro Spada. I don't know when Spada's edition was published, but I assume it is still protected.

Is Puccini's music PD -- in the EU, the US or Canada? I am specifically inquiring about Puccini's music, and not Spada's edition.

MS

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Carolus » Sun Jan 17, 2010 6:00 am

Items first published more than 50 years ago are free in Canada and Asia provided everyone involved died over 50 years ago. In the EU, everything is free except for items first published less than 25 years ago, provided everyone involved died over 70 years ago. In the USA, anything first published before 1923 is free regardless of when the participants died. For the most places, the dates for librettists and arrangers of vocal scores are quite important. For example, we don't know the exact dates of Zuccoli, the arranger of the vocal score for Turandot. Alfano (died 1954) completed that opera, which means it's still protected in the EU (the librettists died in 1946 and 1952). If Zuccoli lived past 1959, we'd have to re-tag the vocal score so that it would be red even for Canada. Most of the vocal scores were arranged by Carignani, who died in 1919 and are thus OK. Forzano, the librettist for 2/3 of Il Trittico (Gianni Schicchi and Suor Angelica), lived until 1970, which means those two operas are under protection even in Asia and Canada, not to mention the EU, etc. (they're free in the USA, however). That's why we have a three-part tagging system. The left-most tag is for Canada, Asia and the 50pma countries, the middle tag is for the USA (with its own unique and hellish ghoulash of a copyright law), while the right-hand tag is for the EU and other 70pma countries. So, the short answer to your question is: it all depends......

UPDATE: I looked it up in Schickling's book. It was actually composed in 1905 and first performed at a ceremony marking the 4th anniversary of Verdi's death. The Spada edition (1976) is probably the first actual publication, though the Ricordi edition issued in 1990 bears a 1974 copyright claim. Canada's treatment of an item like this is unusual because performances and recordings are regarded as equivalent to publication for determination of copyright term. Since the work was actually performed in 1905, it would not fall under Canada's "first publication plus 50 years" rule and would thus be free there as it is over 25 years old in the country of origin (Editio Princeps). The 1976 edition is most likely free in Italy and other parts of the EU as well. Other EU countries might treat this differently, however (especially the UK). Under copyright in the USA.

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Starrmark » Sun Jan 17, 2010 8:48 am

Many thanks for all the information, which I am still trying to sort out. What interests me most is your final sentence, that Puccini's Requiem is still protected in the US (I assume you mean both Pietro Spada's edition and Puccini's original music, since Spada's edition was the first publication of Puccini's music on paper.)

Does the fact that this work was commercially recorded on 78s before 1923 have any bearing on the US copyright status? I have seen the label for this recording reproduced in a book about Puccini (and I would bet a copy is preserved in the State Discoteca in Rome.) If the 1904 public performance constitutes first publication for Canadian copyright law, might not this commercial recording constitute first publication under US copyright law? Or does first publication in the US mean only sheetmusic? What then about music written for films and never published as sheet music? Isn't film music protected following the release of the film?

Doesn't Britain follow the EU's editio princeps (25 years after publication)? In the case of the Puccini Requiem, it's been 35 years. Could this work be published in Britain, with the proviso that it not be performed in the US?

Thanks again,
MS

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Carolus » Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:17 am

Recording does not constitute publication under US law. This is established by both case law and congressional statements in amendments to the Copyright act itself (resulting from the court decisions). First US publication would be 1976, which means the work is protected until Jan. 1, 2072. Film music might be considered published with the release of the film, though it's not entirely clear. Britain is in a transitional period for now with respect to posthumous publications, but eventually will fall under the Editio Princeps rule like most the EU presently does.

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Choralia » Sun Jan 24, 2010 3:41 pm

A recent (July 2009) edition of this work is available at CPDL under Creative Commons Attribution?Noncommercial?Share Alike 3.0 Unported License:

http://www.cpdl.org/wiki/index.php/Requiem_%28Giacomo_Puccini%29

The page reports this work was published in 1905. You may possibly contact the editor to obtain confirmation about this date.

Max

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Carolus » Sun Jan 24, 2010 9:23 pm

Yes, I think that an actual scan of a 1905 publication - even if it was only in a periodical - would be absolutely critical as far as determining the copyright status in the USA. If the actual first publication under US law took place in 1976, or even 1974, the work itself (not just the edition) is still protected in the USA, which means the edition on CDPL would be a technical infringement. Publication of a derivative work includes publication of the original underlying work under the US law's definition of publication, confirmed in a large number of court rulings. The game commonly played by issuing a full score only 70 years after the vocal score created from it is wearing quite thin. It's basically a trick to claim what amounts to a perpetual copyright.

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby ctesibius » Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:34 pm

Hi,
I contacted the prof. Michele Girardi of the Centro Studi G. Puccini (who also edited the Requiem for Carus Verlag).
He confirmed that the piece was first published by Spada.
On the manuscript (at the Conservatory of Milan) there is no copyright since 1994. At least in Italy and/or Europe. For this reason he gently put it online
http://www.puccini.it/cataloghi/requiem1.htm

Ctesibius

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby dibfranciss » Tue May 22, 2012 2:27 pm

ctesibius wrote:Hi,
I contacted the prof. Michele Girardi of the Centro Studi G. Puccini (who also edited the Requiem for Carus Verlag).
He confirmed that the piece was first published by Spada.
On the manuscript (at the Conservatory of Milan) there is no copyright since 1994. At least in Italy and/or Europe. For this reason he gently put it online
http://www.puccini.it/cataloghi/requiem1.htm

Ctesibius


Hello Mr. Ctesibius,

Greetings from Brazil !
I tried this link you provided but it unfortunately doesn't work.
By chance would you please agree to share the manuscript wit me? I would be so happy and grateful, if you agree....
[email removed]

Thank you in advance,

Dib Franciss

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby steltz » Tue May 22, 2012 9:28 pm

Dear Dib Franciss: private file sharing is not allowed at IMSLP. Files must be uploaded to IMSLP so that everyone can have them. I have removed your email address, and if someone can get the file to upload, then that is how it must be shared. Thanks.
bsteltz

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby dibfranciss » Tue May 22, 2012 10:01 pm

steltz wrote:Dear Dib Franciss: private file sharing is not allowed at IMSLP. Files must be uploaded to IMSLP so that everyone can have them. I have removed your email address, and if someone can get the file to upload, then that is how it must be shared. Thanks.


Well, Mr. Steltz...I am a researcher and IMSLP has been helping me since it appeared on the cyberspace. Getting the file I requested to this forum would help me a lot, but anyway...
I thought it was no harm to ask for the this manuscript since someone in the forum had even already shared a link for the Puccini's Requiem, which is unfortunately no longer working.
Furthermore, deleting my email isn't really of great help since your attitude prevented me from the generosity of another member who could possibly help me... but that's ok... this world is becoming more and more boring.

Thanks and my best regards,

Dib Franciss

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Choralia » Wed May 23, 2012 5:34 am

Hi Dib Franciss,

Apparently the page was removed from the Puccini website, maybe for the copyright reasons discussed in previous posts. Anyway, snapshots are still available through the WayBackMachine at http://www.archive.org.

Max

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby dibfranciss » Wed May 23, 2012 1:32 pm

Choralia wrote:Hi Dib Franciss,

Apparently the page was removed from the Puccini website, maybe for the copyright reasons discussed in previous posts. Anyway, snapshots are still available through the WayBackMachine at http://www.archive.org.

Max


Dear Choralia,

Thanks for your kind response. Unfortunately I could not find any trace of Puccini's Requiem in the website you sent me.
If you happen to find another one, I will be so grateful.
Thanks once more.

Dib

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Choralia » Wed May 23, 2012 5:27 pm

Hi Dib,

You probably didn't understand how to use the WayBackMachine. It's a tool that allows you to retrieve snapshots of a website as it was in the past. So:

- visit http://www.archive.org;

- enter the URL that you want to retrieve (http://www.puccini.it/cataloghi/requiem1.htm) in the address bar shown for the WayBackMachine:

wbm.gif
wbm.gif (10.76 KiB) Viewed 6313 times

- select a date when a snapshot is available, and retrieve the page snaphot that was taken at that time.

Max

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby KGill » Wed May 23, 2012 7:52 pm

dibfranciss wrote:... deleting my email isn't really of great help since your attitude prevented me from the generosity of another member who could possibly help me... but that's ok... this world is becoming more and more boring.

The point is that IMSLP doesn't exist just to help individual people privately, it is supposed to be a public resource. Even legal private file sharing is discouraged because it does not contribute to the site at all - if it were allowed, that would mean that by helping people to obtain scores here, we would be encouraging them not to upload it and therefore limiting the quality of our own project.

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Re: Giacomo Puccini's Requiem

Postby Choralia » Sat Jan 02, 2016 8:47 pm

I uploaded today a scan of the Ricordi edition of 1990. It should be public domain in Europe since yesterday, under the "urtext" copyright provisions.

Max


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